Uber admits to self-driving car 'problem' for cyclists

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"Engineers were working to fix programming flaw that could have deadly results for cyclists days after Uber announced it would openly defy California regulators"

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https://www.theguardian.com/technology/2016/dec/19/uber-self-drivin...

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tonydelyall's comment I think needs to be paid attention to: In my dystopian vision of the near future, I have often thought that just as dominant AV use will squeeze out humans driving, it will also inevitably lead to the removal of bicyclists from the AV road space. The Great God Car will always dominate whether human driven or not. The issue of pedestrians or bicyclists being able to intimidate the AVs, and how to determine offences in this regard is likely to be a critical factor possibly only resolvable by segregation, and as there is hardly anywhere for us to be segregated to, the outcome does not look good.

Or perhaps we can say that the good road user doesn't leave it to chance and brakes anyway; until there is certainty.

Anything less than that and an avoidable risk is being accepted.

Strangely I am seeing drivers stop where I wouldn't expect them to. Good. It happened again yesterday, similar to the cyclist crossing a divided road. In this case I was turning right, with an oncoming car. So I signalled right and slowed to wait for the car to continue, somewhat towards the middle of the road. The car stopped. I'm not sure if the human driver decided to give way just-in-case, or if the anti-collision system intervened.

Or perhaps we can say that the good road user doesn't leave it to chance and brakes anyway; until there is certainty.

Certainty?  When does that occur?

If you are driving 80 or 100kph and another car is stopped at a give way sign or traffic light should you slow down and stop to avoid a potential collision on if the car driver decides to move forward?

Your 'good road user' would never get anywhere if it relied upon certainties, nor would an AV.

This might all sound pendantic but this is exactly the considerations that need to be made with self driving cars.


That said I've managed to avoid serious collisions on a bicycle because I was uncertain about a stopped road user's behaviour.  So no doubt caution can be very good but waiting for 'certainty' in an uncertain environment is not the answer either.

'certainty' is what we require in aviation.

As for road safety, zero casualties does depend upon certainty, doesn't it?

As for 80 or 100km/h where someone might enter the space in front of you- that's nuts. Hence the invention of motorways. A non-sterile road is not good enough for those speeds where those risks exist. Hence the reason collision avoidance systems as a minumum shave off speed.

'certainty' is what we require in aviation

Great.  But aviation isn't the roads.

As for road safety, zero casualties does depend upon certainty, doesn't it?
And that is a pipe dream in an uncertain world.

As for 80 or 100km/h where someone might enter the space in front of you- that's nuts. Hence the invention of motorways. A non-sterile road is not good enough for those speeds where those risks exist. 

Huh?  Nuts?  Well that is the current and continuing reality.  And the majority of our highways aren't motorways nor a 'sterile road'.

Meh

Yes Garrwain, I can see it too.

Everything will get dumbed down to the dumbest level so that the AVs can buzz around without being able to hurt anybody - and if you do get hurt, it's your fault because we all know you shouldn't be there.

FYI, completely sort of off topic, I have a underground mining equipment manufacturer customer who use LIDAR as the primary sensory system for their range of completely autonomous loaders and trucks. There is no GPS down there and so the machines use LIDAR not only to see where they are going and not bump into things, but each vehicle uses it to continuously make 3D maps of where they are / where they've been. Then, when the machine passes that way again, it recognises the features of the tunnel walls and knows where it is!

LIDAR can be that good if the data is used right!

For the last few years I've held the optimistic view that people's fear of new technology would mean there would be enormous pressure on AV designers to dial up the "worry level" of the software in their cars, and that this would result in safer roads for people outside cars. AVs slowed to walking speed by the necessary "worry level" would be a price society is willing to pay.

But collisions like this have shown me to be naive. The windcsreen view is so entrenched that people will blame the victim, and demand a smooth and fast ride, carnage be damned.

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